First District Congressional debate

website. >> kob eye witness news 4 presents the live first district debate. >> good evening. i am...  More »

website. >> kob eye witness news 4 presents the live first district debate. >> good evening. i am tom joles welcome to kob's district one debate. we are live at sandia high school. our decision 2012 program is sponsored tonight by aarp. it is on the radio part arer in, kdob. joing us is janice arnold jones and democratic candidate michelle lujan grisham. both candidates have agreed to the debate rules. each candidate will have one minute to make opening statement, later, they will have one minute for a closing statement. the candidates will be given one minute to answer each question and then 45 seconds each for a rebuttal. later the candidates will be allowed to ask the other candidate a question. the answers will be limited to one minute and each has 45 seconds for rebuttal. michelle lujan grisham won the coin toss. elected to go first. >> Ms. Grisham: GOOD EVENING, today, too many new mexicans are worried about keeping jobs or having one and too many others are going without healthcare. and our children don't have the same educational opportunities that we once had. congress is ignoring the very real problems new mexico families face. i often talk about my mother who lives with me because she can't afford to live on her own. now we have three generations under one roof because my daughter has moved back home so she can afford to go to college. when she graduates may not find a job and if she does, she may face a mountain of debt. today sandia high school students will face many of those same challenges. i understand the emotional and financial burdens that new mexico families face. as a widow, single mother and caregiver, these struggles are real and that isy i'll be a champion for the middle class and fight to put new mexicans back to work and i will stand strong against any attacks against our families financial security. i am michelle lujan grisham and i am ready to stand up for you in congress. >> Mr. Jones: AM GRATEFUL TO be here this evening. i am janice arnold jones. running for u.s. house of representatives in new mexico's first congressional district. new mexico and our nation are facing profound problems that are getting worse. we must change course. our national debt is out of control. our entitlement programs are running out of money, economy is floundering under weight of unemployment, much of it long-term. america is losing influence in the world. iran on the verge of acquiring nuclear weapons while own laboratories and military are facing disastrous cuts. new mexico can do better. america can do better. we will all do better together. this election is about deciding who to trust. you trusted me in santa fe. trust me in washington. thank you. >> many new mexicans believe job one in this country is getting people back to work and it is probably easier said that done. new mexico lost more than 12,000 jobs last year alone. how do you stop the bleeding? and how do you help turn the employment situation around? we're going to begin with janice arnold jones. >> Mr. Jones: THE FIRST STEP IS for congress to pass a budget. now, i know that sounds counter intuitive but in a federally did he pent dent state, many paycheck are dependent upon having a budget. we have not had a budget in over three years. and that is paychecks. that are not arriving. but, in addition to that, there are a few things we can do. we need to step up and pull back regulation right this minute. red tape is choking our small businesses and it is the small businesses not our federal sector that actually will be expanding the economy and the ne step is to work on tax reform. taxes must be simple, fair and easy to administer. these steps will get us working again. >> michelle which it comes to job losses in the state, how do you as a congress woman stop the bleeding. >> let's talk quickly the 12,000 job lost in new mexico. new mexico depends much on federal investments and federal jobs as a result and the current inability of congress to focus on jobs and investments in states like new mexico hurts new mexico's economy. that is why we have to pass the jobs bill. jobs act out of congress. that is infrastructure investment, putting plumbers and carpenters and builders back to work building hospitals, bridges and schools. we should work with sandia labs to do spin off technologies and creates entrepreneurs right here on the ground. we have high tech jobs for the future of our kids come out of college and we have got to provide working capital to small businesses. as a small business woman i know what you need is access to capital. let'sake a lesson from the county and apply those tools to congress. where we invested in businesses like lowe's. friedman recycling, provide them with low interest loans and access to capital so they can expand their businesses and hire more new mexicans. this is an agenda for success for jobs in new mexico. >> you have 45 seconds for rebuttal. january. >> Ms. Grisham: WE NEED TO PULL back elements of dodd frank that are choking economy. one of the unintended consequences of that is role of appraisers in housing market. how sad that when there is a need for money, we are at dead stop because of some of the new rules for our appraisers. when i look at and think about investments, i want you to think about that word because oftentimes my opponent means spending. ladies and gentlemen, we are 16 trillion in debt. in order to have the money to invest in programs that we love we have to get our debt under control so that we have more choices. >> michelle, 45 seconds for rebuttal. >> Ms. Grisham: THE ISSUE IS WE are not having a balanced approach to dealing with a budget. but the bundle is not the no. 1 priority. it is investing in new mexicans to go back to work immediately. families are facing tough decisions about whether they pay mortgages or buy groceries. we pass the jobs bill and we can provide micro that support local lenders like credit unions. what we can't do is pass the ryan plan which my opponent supports which is 10% cut to the labs, 20,000 jobs lost in new mexico, these are not the right policies to protect new mexico working families. >> let's talk money management for a moment. for those of us lucky to have jobs we have money coming in and money going out. u.s. government seems to have a lot of money that is going out not as much coming in. what is your plan for getting a grip on this? >> Ms. Grisham: IT GIVES ME opportunity to talk more about that balanced approach. we definitely have to be careful about spending money when we have programs are inefficient and ineffective and don't have the right outcomes. we don't want to engage in wasteful spending. but we need to make sure we bring revenue into this country and there are several ways to do that. one, wealthiest need to pay their fair share of taxes. we must let the bush tax cuts expire for the wealthiest of americans. that top 2%. we have to close corporate loopholes. we're continuing to subsidize big oil and gas. when those companies are paying 18% federal income tax and you and i are paying 30 plus percent, something is wrong. let's close toes loopholes and not subsidize. that gives us revenue to deal with the deficit and invest in working families families in new mexico today. >> as a congress woman, what would you do to get a grip on revenue spending imbalance p. >> Mr. Jones: YOU HAVE TO LOOK at it straight on. we are spending 3.6 trillion and we're only taking in 2.2. you all have checkbooks. you know that does not work. we are going to have to make some very tough decisions. no matter what you think about on the periphery at the end of the day, we have a spending problem that is compounded by agencies like pimco who announced they are going to increase interests that is being charged on our debt which will complicate this yet again. so, there are no easy answers we are going to have to make some tough choices. now, that being said, where do we cut first? i think you have to look at administration. we take all of the low hanging fruit, we exercise every single step that you can to be physically responsible and then we will make those very tough decisions. but, i have to go back to my opponent who wants to mix up income taxes. you know i spent eight years on the tax committee and corporate tax and personal income tax, they are not the same. >> you have 45 seconds for a rebuttal. Ms. Grisham: THEY ARE TWO sources of revenue and income tax on the welliest of americans provides a trillion dollars back to the federal budget. why are we subsidizing big oil and gas. that is three billion. if we look at where we can have savings, let's address affordable care act and notion that medicare is now prohibited from negotiating for fair drug prices. this is hundreds of millions of dollars back to the federal budget which allow you to deal with the deficit and deal with the debt while at the same time making smart investments and moving economy. we know that cutting your way out of this problem leads to further financial disasters. if we don't do that, we're facing sequestration which is a debt reduction effort by congress who failed to take responsibility where they are going to cut everything by 10%. that is more job losses to new mexico. >> your rebuttal. >> Mr. Jones: WE HAVE TO WATCH the numbers. to say the rich, millionaires would contribute 1 trillion, let's look at numbers. if we took every millionaire in the country, they could provide revenue for a month and then what? because would you take all of their assets. those are not fair comparisons. but in fact we have got to go back in and make sure that we are actually being fiscally responsible. you can talk about healthcare all day long but the truth is, our government is much broader than that, but if we stay in debt, the healthcare that we all want is not going to be there. >> now, to question three and district 1 debate. every few years we go through a process where candidates stands up here and tells us i'll work for you. they get to congress and big and important everyone wants to their friend and lobbyist work them over, there is money every where. how do you plan to stay focused on what new mexico needs and not become just another reelection sound byte. >> Mr. Jones: I LOVE THAT question. having served eight years in new mexico legislature, i understand what it is like to be lobbies and not. when you have a set principles and lobbyist know that you cannot be bought, you actually have a lot of time to focus. but the way you actually do this is by staying connected with folks back home. now, i have proposed number of times that we have to change the schedule of congress. they go to work on tuesday and get home thursday at noon. hard to build relationships. i have been working and i propose that congress go to work monday morning, through saturday, three weeks on two weeks off because what i know is there needs to be time in the district where we have enough time to talk about the problems and to listen to you because what i have learned about new mexico is you actually have the answers. if i take the time to listen. >> michelle, what lilo do if you go to washington, what are you going to do to make sure you rember who you are working for? >> M Grisham: I HAVE NEVER forgotten who i work for which is why i worked for three different governors both republican and democrat for 17 years in state government serving the public. we had incredible successes reaching across the aisle and doing things like expanding school base health centers attacking scam artists and people stealing the life savings of seniors, building the new state lab, these are efforts and county commission, in fact, we cleaned up county government, put new mexicans back to work, these are the kinds of efforts, integrity, your independence, your desire to make a difference and given the fact that i am a single mom and caregiver, i don't forget about what the needs are of new mexicans and how tough those struggles are everyday. that is how your motivated to continue to focus on doing what is right and improving quality of life for new mexico, i have done that my entire career and i will continue to do that in congress. >> your rebuttal? >> Mr. Jones: QUICKLY, THIS IS really about paying attention to you. you know, when i was in the legislature, we talked about many things, certainly way beyond healthcare, and what i have learned is talking with you, there are many sides to every question. making sure that you understand all of those sides, so can you make the very best decision, certainly, that takes focus and it was probably one of the things that i enjoyed most which is also why with the help of a lot of people, we took web cams to santa fe because you have a right to participate in your government. >> Ms. Grisham: IT IS NOT ABOUT focus for me. it is about action, being very clear about what you're doing and why. and about getting those things done. now, i have got a real record of accomplishments over a 20 year history, including working in private sector. when economy was failing in 2008 i started a successful which business which provides health insurance to individuals who have preexisting conditions and cannot get coverage in any other way and those high risk pools that provide this coverage are some of the most successful programs in entire country because it is understanding the real life and death situations and issues th new mexico families face, address those and certainly be clear about what is harmful in congress. i will tell you the ryan budget is harmful to new mexico. it destroys medicare, destroyeds medicaid and loss of 20,000 jobs. >> let's move on to question 4. congress is as divided as i can ever rember. there might be times when the party line isn't what is best for us. in those times can you stand up to your party and say, this does not work for new mexico? and also, are you willing to reach across the aisle once in a while and do you see compromise as a dirty word? >> Ms. Grisham: ABSOLUTELY NOT. let's talk about something that occurred in county commission. the county does not invest in regional transportation effort but paseo is a project on the priority list for statement government and federal government for almost a decade. folks were having partisan fights about who should fund it, why you should fund it. so i took a leadership role and decided county ought to provide funding. now, that catalyst led to the city putting in 50 million and state putting in 30 million and federal government putting in rest. for the first time voters have option on the entire package to put new mexicans back to work to address public safety and get people to and from work. hundreds of jobs today and thousands of jobs in the future. this meant working across the aisle, with both parties, taking a leadership position and standing against the county who initially determined that these were not investments that we should make. every investment that i'm proves the quality of life of new mexico is an investment we should be making. >> are you willing to stand up to your own party if it does not work for new mexico and what do you think about compromise? >> Mr. Jones: STANDING UP FOR what is right is what i have been doing all of my life. whether it is helping to write criminal sexual conduct code, setting up rape cris centers in hawaii and new mexico, setting up court watch programs, standing up for what is right is simply what i do. but, reaching across the aisle, this bipartisan approach, here is what i have learned as a legislator. you have to have relationships. the fact is, why would somebody else give me their vote if they had no idea that i understood their issues or much less that they could trust way say. building those relationships is absolutely vital and i truly understand is that but, you know, i passed legislation in the new mexico legislature and here is the oddity, there are 45 democrats when i was there and only 25 republicans. in order to pass legislation, there is not a single piece that did not pass a democratic co-sponsor with me. that is how it works. however, being a cabinet secretary when your in a majority body, you don't have too that. >> michelle, your 45 second rebuttal. >> Ms. Grisham: LET'S TALK about when i was innocent majority, working for gary johnson. in that administration, one of the top priorities was removing all regulation and not just necessary regulation. nursing homes were a huge problem. i couldn't get a single state official with the authority to act to take responsibility. so, i went undercover and took responsibility, exposed horrible neglect and now new mexico is only state in the country that does undercover evaluations and in that administration, with the minority, we created some of the most consumer protection including requiring background checks for workers and real penalties for nursing homes who neglect their residents. did i that in republican environment, with minority by bridging relationships and focusing on things that matter. >> Mr. Jones: THREE POINTS. the first one is, discussion of paseo del norte, i appreciate my opponents zeal but in fact in the legislature when i served there we were funding that project with capital outlay. it really was hardly a discussion but to say that because of partisan efforts that you led the way is truly overstatement. the second. michelle, i am going to tell you this again. the ryan proposal is simply that. a proposal. for you to say that i am tied to it in anyway, i am a legislator and proposals are meant to be debated. you can talk about it all day long. it doesn't make it true. last, i appreciate the undercover activity. but, really, i have a question, why, after starting the undercover activity in 1997, did it take so long to be effective? >> we're delighted aarp is co-sponsoring the debate. joing us on the stage is chairman of the group's legislative committee that would be mr. garza. aarp will present the next three questions. >> go ahead with your first question. >> as healthcare costs rise and medicare costs increase, what is the best way to improve funding for medicare? >> Mr. Jones: THE FIRST STEP TO improve funding for medicare is to pull back the 716 billion taken it from by the affordable care act. next most important is to pull back the 27% that will be taken from our providers if we expect to have a program that actually deliveries care to our seniors there has to be providers. that 27% reduction in reimbursement affects doctors, physician assistants, nurses, nurse practitioners, across the board. and the answers to providing the funding to make these changes is to expand our economy. we have to get people working again so that, guess what, they canay more taxes, so people have more choices. >> Ms. Grisham: HERE IS WHAT we're not going to do. the ryan is a budget that passed house three times. here it what it does, it turns medicare into avoucher program, leaving future beneficiaries to have to negotiate with insurance companies, costing seniors 6,400 for. my mom certainly isn't in a position to afford those additional co-pays and either am i as her caregiver. here is what we do to strengthen medicare. affordable care act is terrific opportunity to is strengthen medicare. 716 billion tt she referred to came out of windfall profit to insurance companies, returned right back to medicare beneficiaries to close the hole. that is the place that seniors end up when they can no longer afford prescription drugs because the benefit has run out. ryan plan takes that medicare benefit and puts it toward general budget. we'll have medicare neglect wait a drug companies. >> Mr. Jones: MICHELLE, WE HAVE to be careful with the facts. first off, the ryan bundle may have passed the house. its did not become a budget until passed by the senate. it is merely a proposal. i hope that you will bring a proposal of your own so we can discuss it. to say that particular proposal was going to gut 6400, i hope you red the latest proposal. there is nothing close to that and third to say that 716 billion dollars came out of windfall profits, it is simply not true. it came out of medicare and the worst of that is that for every dollar of increased benefits, there is a 15 dollar loss and if you're not sure, please there is a website we have put up, the michelle record.com. check it out, you can see for yourself. >> Ms. Grisham: I DISAGREE entirely. medicare provides a program or incentive payments to managed care companies called medicare advantage. the deal here is that we pay a routine payment to those insurance companies whether the beneficiary is using healthcare or not and those became huge windfall profits that went right to ceo salaries and related issues. and that money absolutely went right back to close the donut hole. i spent 20 years being advocate for medicare and i a sure you my interpretation of what is currently occurring in the affordable care act is accurate. in addition, here is what we need to do with medicare. we need to do is focus on preventing and treating chronic disease. in new mexico, diabetes is number 1 concern. this is hundreds of millions back to medicare. >> your second question. >> would you support cuts in social security and medicare to address the budget deficit or do you think social security and medicare should be kept separate? >> Ms. Grisham: I WOULD NOT BE willing to ever cut the benefits in medicare or social security. these efforts actually, if we don't sustain those programs, have drastic economic consequences for the future of this country and retirees. these are family issues. people forget that social security is also a family benefit. providing survivor benefits and dependent benefits. without those investments we would those survivors in a position to be in a situation where they would lose their homes and a home for the future. medicare is same issue. if we don't provide benefits that reduces healthcare costs so the growing aging and disabled population, those are the costs that cripple this country in the future. the best effort is to continue our investment and shore up the strength of the programs. reality is, while we combine the payroll taxes for both these programs, i think there are modernization efforts that we can undertake. i would never under mine the protections for social security and medicare in this country. >> your answer? >> Mr. Jones: FIRST, IF YOU'RE over 55, i will stand and make sure that your benefits do not change. second, for that group, i think it is time that we make sure that the cost of living allowance at least equals inflation. third, i am looking at the young people in the audience. i cannot make that same promise to you at this time unless we change the age of eligibility. i want that program to be there for you but i do not want to stand here and not tell you the truth. we are going to have to look at that. but, there is some other actions that we can take to improve the solvency, especially of social security. we are still siphoning interests off the social security trust fund. it is time to put it back so th it is solvent and last and most important, for both programs. the more people we put back to work, the more people who are paying into the system, the more solvent both programs are and that is the most important thing we can do. >> michelle, your rebuttal. >> Ms. Grisham: AS I MENTIONED, these are family benefits. when you look out in the audience and say, for those folks 55 and older, you're fine, which i have to reiterate is exactly the medicare plan in the ryan budget. but, this is the issue. what about all the young disabled adults and young veterans on are on disability benefits and rely on social security in their families. are we going to say that population to that population we are sorry that this country made this commitment to you and in spite of working and paying into the system your entire life it goes away? i don't think that is the strong cntry that we build from. i don't think that that is the country that provides a real future for your young people and their families. getting people back to work is clearly effort that will make a difference. why again it is so important to get congress become to work. >> Mr. Jones: THE DD WAIVER program in the state of new mexico is a mess. however, adults with development & disabilities and our veterans who have come back with traumatic brain injury will require our support for the rest of their lives. i have been committed to that care since i was elected and well before that. and so when we look at the solvency, that is a very special program. >> third and final aarp question. go ahead. >> the supreme court made it harder for older workers to prove age discrimination in the workplace. currently, older workers are having a hard time finding employment in this economy. do you support the u.s. senate bill s2189 which would restore protectionsgainst age discrimination for older workers? >> Mr. Jones: I HAVE NOT READ f2189. and so i am going to take a guess at it but i like the to read the bills so let's talk about concepts. i appreciate that younger people need to work. our population is aging. our span of being productive has changed. and, quite frankly, i find it irresponsible and uncomprehensible to ever have age limit requirements. we need the experience of our seniors. we need their wisdom. and to have anything stand in the way, i just can't even understand. >> Ms. Grisham: DISCRIMINATION of any kind can no longer be tolerated in this country and that clearly goes to able discrimination for retirees and older workers as well. the reality is that there are so many studies that indicate that retirees who are back in the workplace, whether it is in a brand new full-time job or a part-time job, equivalent to the kinds of things that you were doing before retirement actually improved the health status of this population which reduces our healthcare costs and provides a much needed benefit in the workplace. the reality is that once we g this economy moving for many jobs, we may not have enough young workers to take those jobs, creating environment where equal access and it is economic security particularly for older women. who often are making less, have less social security, less benefits, less private retirement income, and without that working income, they are at or below the poverty line. we need to do everything we can to create equitable financial security for older workers and their families. >> go ahead with your rebuttal. >> Mr. Jones: I DON'T HAVE A rebuttal on this one. >> Ms. Grisham: THERE IS SO much to talk about in that design. new mexico has fastest growing grandparents raising grandchildren in the country. when you talk about these benefits and these programs that we're going to stamp out discrimination, i want folks to lead with, these are absolutely family issues. providing opportunity for older works to have sufficient income to support their entire family is critical to the health of our economy and the health of new mexico's economy. >> all right. thank you mr. garza . thank you aarp for those questions. as part of the did bebait, we asked viewers to submit questions. here is stuart with some questions. >> all right. first question comes from john jones from albuquerque. and john asks, what is the single greatest threat facing this nation today and what will you do to help with resolving it? >> Ms. Grisham: THANK YOU. i have to say i am going to cheat on this answer. we have two significant national threats. one is clearly the economy and the fiscal cliff we are headed towards if we end up without investments in our economy and putting people back to work, and we have sequestration wre we cut programs and investments by 10% and we can't be the strong leader the future if that is the direction we head in. it is unfortunate that not one of us can forget 911. and that there are real terrorism issues and extremists in this world that mean harm to americans and our allies. we must have a robust military that is designed to invest in modernization much like the work here in new mexico for drones so that we can exercise diplomacy that is robust, but making sure we're prepared to do what is necessary to prevent iran from acquiring nuclear weapons. >> janice arnold jones, your answer? >> Mr. Jones: IT IS VERY CLEAR. the single greatest threat to our nation is our national debt. now, as a navy wife, i assure you that i understand what it means to defense this nation. but what cuts at very status of our country is the debt. we are no longer a force. bargaining chip that we had in the international community has been significantly diminished and it is true that our military forces are threatened but the threat comes from the beginning which is our national debt. so, making sure that we start pulling back the debt that we are proactive that we make a commitment to reduce tha debt is probably the single greatest thing that we can do. and in doing so, we will provide security for our children and also remove a moral obligation from their backs that they should not have. debt is the single greatest threat. >> Ms. Grisham: REALITY IS IF we let the bush tax cuts for wealthiest american, top 2% expire, that is one trillion dollars that goes right to dealing with the national debt and deficit. that also gives us opportunity to manage and invest in second part of my answer which is making sure we're prepared for the real threats in the world and that we can stand firm with our allies on those issues. these are opportunities for us to have a balanced approach, move the economy forward and provide the investments, including right here at home. at kirtland and sandia, los alamos labs, so that we're prepared to build an economy that sustainable for the future and an environment where we are protecting ourselves and democratic alies across the world. >> Mr. Jones: I WOULD LIKE TO call your attention to some math. we have heard that the bush tax cuts will saves a trillion dollars. and the ceo's in the healthcare industry, that is another trillion. i hope your keeping track of the dollars here. if you want to deal with our debt, the most important thing we have to do is to get our economy moving. that means, pulling back regulations so small business can actually be productive. they need to hire people. we need to make sure that taxes are simple, fair and easy to administer and more importantly, make sure that there is an attitude that business should be competive. looking to our government to pick out winners and losers has been a sure recipe for lack of success. let's turn that around. it is time for us to succeed. >> stuart, our second viewer question. >> stuart: our next question is from rio rancho and frank potter. he wants to know, if you are elected, would you be willing to push hard for our government to stop sending taxpayer money in the form of aid to so many countries around the world and instead use the money for the things we need here at home? >> Mr. Jones: THE CURRENT foreign aid is about 1% of our total budget. i am not a fan of sending money to countries that don't like us. and that actually, i call, are enemies. in order to be a good global citizens there are times that we need to come together. a good example, years ago, the flood, and japan when the earthquake hit, yeah, we should show up for our friends and support the international community. i do get this question frequently because i think many people think it is about 25% of our budget. it is less than 1%. >> Ms. Grisham: IT IS EFFECTIVE in-test meant in making sure that we're engaging in appropriate and robust diplomacy around the world. we're findly building that credibility around the world and that crees the right partnerships and opportunity to actually create additional democracies which reduce those national threats to this country. it is also are you that we must -- it is also true we must return to domestic agenda. we must bring troops home sooner than later. we want to be clear about the priorities and that really is about moving economy forward and being clear we want to put new mexicans back to work. i am going to return to the single most important thing that congress could do today, pass the jobs bill, spend that infrastructure spending, get people back to work, hit those folks who are hurt the hardest in this downed economy and those are construction partners, and create environment where you ever jobs for the future. these are the kinds of things that will return and restore our economy to a much healthier environment, give us opportunity to deal with the debt and the deficit. these are smart policies for america. >> we seem to be getting off track a little bit. do you want rebuttal. >> Mr. Jones: WHEN IT COMES TO foreign aid, you know, a little bit off track but let's talk about some solutions. you know, when we pull out of countries like iran and -- excuse me -- iraq and afghanistan, it is easy to say we're going to literally just receive all military members and put them in the job market that doesn't exist. we have to think very carefully about how we do that. our economy is extremely fragile so putting more people literally on the market without any alternative is not a good domestic agenda. >> Ms. Grisham: I AM NOT SURE I understand that answer. the way i heard that is it is more appropriate to have those folks in conflicts and putting them in harm's way instead of returning them back home and creating an environment where we are engaging in work. >> what we you saying. >> Mr. Jones: I AM SAYING THAT to simply receive military members and putting them in the economy is not right. and so when you do that pull back, you have to do so with planning. there is a discussion that we can have currently on the blocks, 47,000 members of the navy and marines and i am concerned about them not having jobs, let's talk about some solutions and some of those solutions could be beefing unthe border and it needs a transition from the military to border patrol. >> third and final viewer question. >> stuart: john mayer wants to know, if you're elected, will you make this a life long career? >> Ms. Grisham: I WANT TO BE your congresswoman for as long as i make a difference and focus on things that matter and improving lives of new mexicans and families. that is the reason i am running to make a difference. i have a real record of accomplishment from my private business to my work at county commission where we expanded healthcare services and cleaned up county government and invested in jobs and economy and same kind of record of success in state government. we can have those successes again in congress. congress must take responsibility for taking immediate action to address these concerns and issues and i am going to stay as long as it takes to make those differences for new mexico families. >> do you want to make washington your permanent address? >> Mr. Jones: I HAVE ALREADY lived there one time. you know, in the 35 years that i have owned two small businesses, managed another one, been a navy wife where i have actually created programs in every city that we lived in, you know what, i don't need another career. what i need and what i want to do is to take the time to represent you and for me the clock is ticking. so, i have to be efficient. i have to get it done because you don't want another career bureaucrat. you want someone who urgently wants to represent you and solve the problems of new mexico. i have that urgency. the clock is ticking. >> Ms. Grisham: AGAIN, I THINK this is issue where you want to be able to demonstrate and i hope i am doing that this evening, that i am running for congress because i don't think any of us can afford to wait a second longer for a congress that is willing to compromise and work across the aisle, to focus on the things that matter, to invest in new mexico families, to have a balanced approach to solving the problems that have not been addressed in this congress at all. i am dedicated and committed to doing that job in effective and responsible manner for as long as i am able to do that and for as long as the district will have me. >> Mr. Jones: ALL GOOD THOUGHTS and just kind of a general question. i would like to hear what a balanced approach is. and how you invest without spending. >> Ms. Grisham: I AM WAITING for permission. >> we'll have to move on. with so much at stake for young people in this election, we have asked one student fm teacher time at sandia to ask a question. sean, your concerned about the federal deficit and how your generation is going to pay for it. go ahead with your question. >> yeah. so, the deficit and current debt has increased dramatically over the past few years, dating back to 2000. you 2 have spoken in generalities but what specific measures will you take to slow the growth of deficit so we're not responsible for repaying 6 trillion of debt that are currently being accumulated. >> we're going to begin with -- >> Mr. Jones: THANK YOU FOR that question. this is where it really is important to be a legislator. you have to get in and look at the budget. you have to decide to make some cuts. now, as a legislator with experience, i know we're going to take the low hanging fruit to begin with. i don't witness to get into the weeds here but here is how this works. would you be surprised if budge that fund people cut that out. then we look at elements of our government and make some very difficult choices. because, at the end of the day, sean, you don't deserve this debt hung around your neck, and able that debt today is over 50,000 that your going to have to pay back if we don't address it. so, are there priorities, of course, there are. for me, you do the most important things, you defense our country. you take care of the fragile populations including people who need our dd waivers, our veterans with traumatic brain injury. you keep your word. there is not a whole lot left to start cutting but we have to make the really tough choices about all of the other programs whether it is transportation, infrastructure. there is a lot to do. >> Ms. Grisham: TAKE A STEP pack and rember how we got into the situation that we're in today. all right? at the very same time that we went to war, we provided deep tax cuts for the wealthiest of americans and middle class which i want to say right now, san, intend to protect because they are hit hardest in this economy, but those two efforts caused us to spiral into a situation where we have got the worst economy ever. let's also rember that wall street did us no favors by making sure that we have a stable financialen environment in this country. given those three factors, i think it is absolutely appropriate to say that a balanced approach is the following. we're going to close the bush tax cut for wealthiest. we're going to make sure that special interests and oil in gas, they are not subsidized weather making record profits in this country and that is revenue that we can address the deficit with. there by impacting debt and invest in the no. 1 thing that turns economy around. putting americans become to work. >> i cut you off, would you like to continue? >> Mr. Jones: I WON'T GO INTO my rebuttal. we heard about the bush tax cuts. you know, pr president bush hasn't been president for a really long time. we need to get over it but those tax cuts right now are really helping a lot of people. special interests, let's get our facts straight. oil and gas do not receive special subjectcy did is and i am glad to bore but depression and all the things that actually are share arked across the manufacturing strata and they are not special and investing in our people, you know what, this is all plat tubes. real true is, with regard toison's question, have you to -- you have to do the hard work of making a budget that currently is spending 3.6 trillion come down to spending only 2.2 or whatever is coming in. >> Ms. Grisham: I DISAGREE. i identified depletion allowance as example in the last debate about oil and gas getting special breaks. here is what it is, it allows a company like exxon to take as a capital equipment deduction oil in the ground. i am fairly certain that manufacturing companies who are not drilling for oil are not getting this benefit. and they receive other specialized benefits and the most important issue here is we invested in oil and gas so that we would have affordable energy and reliable power and energy in this country. that is well and good but today they are making record profits and in this environment where the middle class is hit hardest and we're having a conversation about the future of our children and making sure that we create an earn environment where the economy is robust, why would you continue to subsidize those individuals and enties? >> thank you sawn for that question. i can see your teacher is proud of you. >> as i mentioned at the top of the debate, we have sergeanted out time for candidates to each other one question. what is your question for michelle in. >> Mr. Jones: MICHELLE, I WOULD like for you to explain the various taxes that actually exist that you would alter since the depletion allowance you don't understand. >> Ms. Grisham: I AM PRETTY sure i understand that just fine and i also appreciate why it that we're having a debate about tax reform. so, i am going to restate again taxes that i think are most important to allow to expire. i want the wealthiest of americans to pay their fair share. i want to keep the protection for the middle class. we're hit the hardest in this economy. i want to make sure that the loop holes for companies who are incentivized to take jobs overseas, taking deductions and credits for things that did not benefit this country, or growing economy, that those should be removed. i do favor engaging in investing in these tax deductions, i agree that small businesses being a small business, that we want to reduce corporate taxes. those taxes, i think, are aggressive and do cause small businesses not to have sufficient resources to expand businesses. now, in county government, i held firm, on not growing or increasing corporate taxes for small businesses and aisle take those same agenda items to washington and protect the middle class. >> your rebuttal? >> Mr. Jones: LET'S JUST TALK about the depletion allowance. i like to get it straight. depletion allowances apply to everybody who is in the ex tracktive industries, oil and gas, all ming companies and including companies that make clay flowerpots and that also includes timber. it is not uncommon for tax policy to deal with entire industry across the board. you're right, extracting industries are not manufacturing, they are extracting. manufacturing has a different set of specific tax policies that make them productive. >> would you like to rerespond. >> Ms. Grisham: I DON'T SEE HOW any of those allowances are productive. we are subsidizing industry is that has record profits, 137 billion in profits and we're investing between three and four billion in subsidizing them. this is not sound policy. this is investing in folks who did not need us to succeed. while failing to recognize that many others need that support investment so they fairly compete and creating environment where more businesses can succeednd that more businesses can come home and have their businesses expand to manufacturing plants right here in the good ole us of a. >> go ahead. >> Ms. Grisham: IN THE campaign, we have had plenty of opportunities to talk frankly about women's healthcare and women's access to comprehensive healthcare and reproductive choices. have you demonstrated empathy for the difficulty that women face in unwanted pregnancy. however, you are endorsed by an an extreme anti-choice organization that does not support a woman's right to choose even in cases of rape and incest. i want you to clarify where you stand on equality for women, reproductive choice and the economic security for women and their families. >> Mr. Jones: I APPRECIATE THAT question because the end of your question is the most important part of the answer. because if you want to talk about women's equality, then we need to talk about the economy. women will gain equality, will will be able to actually have choices when they can put a roof over their head, feed their children, make sure gas is in the car so they can get to work and to the doctor's appointment. that is the type of equality that women want. you're asking me specifically about birth control contraception and abortion. i believe the very last choice that ever should be made is to end the life of an innocent. that being said, the government, the united states has been providing this type of service for women for almost a half a decade. and so, it is allredly available. the fact that i am endorsed by a group feels one way doesn't necessary mean that i believe in outlaying anything. but, i am telling you that my belief is in preserving life. it is sacred to me. >> Ms. Grisham: YOU SEEM inconsistent to may. to gain endorsement, you have to be pretty clear that you do not believe in a woman's right to choose in cases of rape and incest and that you also will fight against providing access to contraceptives and birth control in family planning and if you believe that these are protections for women's economic future and you have to support those programs. planned parenthood is under attack like never before. those programs which provide 97% of a woman's primary healthcare, which means we're doing mammograms and breast cancer screening, saving the lives of these women and making sure that they are around for their families financial security. are you going to stand against this organization and the tea party extremists in the house who have done everything they can to cut those services? >> Mr. Jones: YOU KNOW, PLANNED parenthood is really a diverse organization and they do good things including providing primary care. i have no problem with that but the question comes down to moral issues and a question of a challenge to freedom of region. for those of us who believe life is sacred, don't ask me to pay for that. nobody is making it illegal, but don't require me to pay for it. don't require a religious organization to provide services that they believe are immoral. it comes as simple as that. >> we have come to the end of the debate. each candidate will have one minute for closing statement. we begin with janice arnold jones. >> Mr. Jones: I LOVE THIS country. my ancestors fled to this country to find peace and liberty. my mom came to new mexico to find a new life. new mexico is my home. it is the state that i love. you know, new mexico has everything we need. we have everything we need to create wealth and prosperity from construction to ming, timber, agriculture, wind anderson. we have it all. i am asking you to send me to congress. i am not flashy. i am not verbose. i work hard. and i listen. the question before you will of us is what are we going to do to change the discourse in our country. none of us like it. i am diligent. i read the bills. if you think that these are important qualities, i will represent you well. this is about trust. you trusted me in santa fe, trust me in washington. thank you. >> thank you tom. i want to tank thank kob and sandia high school. i have deep roots here. you know that and i am proud that every heritage because it scenes that i know new mexico and more importantly it scenes that i know new mexicans. now, i spent my entire career fighting for new mexico families and as i stated in my opening, i am ready to that i can that fight to washington because that is really where we are. we are going to have to fight for jobs and economic security for the middle class. we're going to have to fight to make sure we aren't saddling college student with more duct today than all the auto and credit card debt in this country. i am going to fit the make sure women have protection for comprehensive healthcare and reproductive justice in this country. it is economic security for women and family the and am i going to fight to protect it. this is environment where so much is at stake. and new mexico families can't afford to wait. my month can't afford to wait, my daughter can't afford to wait. i respectfully ask for your vote. thank you. >> thank you and good night.  « Less